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	<title>Comments for Geek By Night</title>
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		<title>Comment on Blog Update by Donny Gagliardo</title>
		<link>http://geekbynight.com/?p=308#comment-522</link>
		<dc:creator>Donny Gagliardo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Mar 2012 15:13:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://geekbynight.com/?p=308#comment-522</guid>
		<description>Informed decision-making comes from a long tradition of guessing and blaming others for inadequate results.
The herd instinct among forecasters makes sheep resemble independent thinkers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Informed decision-making comes from a long tradition of guessing and blaming others for inadequate results.<br />
The herd instinct among forecasters makes sheep resemble independent thinkers.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Texas Holdem Rulings by Sammy Wynn</title>
		<link>http://geekbynight.com/?p=269#comment-203</link>
		<dc:creator>Sammy Wynn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jan 2012 13:56:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://geekbynight.com/?p=269#comment-203</guid>
		<description>Here is one for you that happened the other night at MotorCity:

Inexperienced dealer not paying attention. I am out of the hand in seat 6 when the player to my immediate right announces all-in and puts a stack of red over the betting line. The players in seat 1 and seat 4 also heard the all-in declaration.

The dealer sees the stack and tells the player in seat 10 the bet is 100. He has 200 behind.

The bettor says he was all-in and floor gets called.

Floor did not know what to do - so he calls a pit manager - pit manager does not bother to come over, he phones in a &quot;make him pay&quot;.

Wrong decision - dealer mistake means the 100 is dead money UNLESS the bettor wants to give it back - the seat 10 guy is not on the hook for the rest of his stack since the dealer told him the wrong bet amount. (lesson is to announce all-in twice - i say all-in - then i look the dealer in the eye and say all-in again so there is no question as to the play).

Fortunately for seat 10, floor was talked into the correct decision - money over the line is dead to the pot - but he came damn close to getting felted (had he intended to call an all-in, he would have put the whole stack out and not just enough for a call - granted the bettor screwed up by not putting his whole stack over - he only had 400 more)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here is one for you that happened the other night at MotorCity:</p>
<p>Inexperienced dealer not paying attention. I am out of the hand in seat 6 when the player to my immediate right announces all-in and puts a stack of red over the betting line. The players in seat 1 and seat 4 also heard the all-in declaration.</p>
<p>The dealer sees the stack and tells the player in seat 10 the bet is 100. He has 200 behind.</p>
<p>The bettor says he was all-in and floor gets called.</p>
<p>Floor did not know what to do &#8211; so he calls a pit manager &#8211; pit manager does not bother to come over, he phones in a &#8220;make him pay&#8221;.</p>
<p>Wrong decision &#8211; dealer mistake means the 100 is dead money UNLESS the bettor wants to give it back &#8211; the seat 10 guy is not on the hook for the rest of his stack since the dealer told him the wrong bet amount. (lesson is to announce all-in twice &#8211; i say all-in &#8211; then i look the dealer in the eye and say all-in again so there is no question as to the play).</p>
<p>Fortunately for seat 10, floor was talked into the correct decision &#8211; money over the line is dead to the pot &#8211; but he came damn close to getting felted (had he intended to call an all-in, he would have put the whole stack out and not just enough for a call &#8211; granted the bettor screwed up by not putting his whole stack over &#8211; he only had 400 more)</p>
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		<title>Comment on Dick Move or Smart Move? by Eric</title>
		<link>http://geekbynight.com/?p=284#comment-24</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jan 2012 01:56:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://geekbynight.com/?p=284#comment-24</guid>
		<description>In the second situation, the Dealer proceeded to tell the whole table that only certain words were allowed in Poker...raise, call, fold, bet, etc.  He seemed very confident in himself and what he was saying.  I must admit that this is probably where I get most of my poker knowledge; from other players and dealers.  How am I supposed to sort out which is accurate or not?  Perhaps I need to start reading the poker magazines more often.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In the second situation, the Dealer proceeded to tell the whole table that only certain words were allowed in Poker&#8230;raise, call, fold, bet, etc.  He seemed very confident in himself and what he was saying.  I must admit that this is probably where I get most of my poker knowledge; from other players and dealers.  How am I supposed to sort out which is accurate or not?  Perhaps I need to start reading the poker magazines more often.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Dick Move or Smart Move? by Sammy Wynn</title>
		<link>http://geekbynight.com/?p=284#comment-23</link>
		<dc:creator>Sammy Wynn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jan 2012 23:28:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://geekbynight.com/?p=284#comment-23</guid>
		<description>I say dick moves on both counts ... but it really comes down to these players making small mistakes that will cost them.

For example, the A-A vs A-K, the player was very careful to say he had the winning hand ... fold. Had he said something like, &quot;i think i have you beat ... fold&quot; your pal could have called floor to try to get that hand mucked - double dick move i guess.

Your pal made the mistake on the second hand by the way he said it - could be interpreted 2 ways, and to avoid a string bet situation where one is trying to get a reaction from the opposition, the floor ruled the way they did because it was murky ...

That said, both players made mistakes that could be viewed as collusion - which is the foundation of poker rules - prevent collusion among players at the table. It is unethical for one player to tell the other to fold (which by the way violates the one player per hand rule) or say I owe you one fold ... what happens when these guys are in a hand with a third player between them? This history is going to look and smell like they are working together - not cool, and depending on the card room, not safe.

The second example - the player&#039;s words boil down to call - regardless if he folds or not - he called - end of story by saying &quot;i will pay you ...&quot; ... the dealer was wrong by saying he did not have to pay.

No disrespect to charity rooms, but this type of stuff is exactly why I avoid them - especially for cash games ... my recommendation for you would be Motor City or MGM (in that order) ...

Too many players watch too much television - they do not have the skill or experience to try to get fancy with the verbal game - they need to stick to saying &quot;call, raise, fold&quot; ...

Now, I play the occasional tournament at a charity room, and without exception, i see mistakes by dealers and floor every night - they too generally do not have the experience or training to know the little details and such ...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I say dick moves on both counts &#8230; but it really comes down to these players making small mistakes that will cost them.</p>
<p>For example, the A-A vs A-K, the player was very careful to say he had the winning hand &#8230; fold. Had he said something like, &#8220;i think i have you beat &#8230; fold&#8221; your pal could have called floor to try to get that hand mucked &#8211; double dick move i guess.</p>
<p>Your pal made the mistake on the second hand by the way he said it &#8211; could be interpreted 2 ways, and to avoid a string bet situation where one is trying to get a reaction from the opposition, the floor ruled the way they did because it was murky &#8230;</p>
<p>That said, both players made mistakes that could be viewed as collusion &#8211; which is the foundation of poker rules &#8211; prevent collusion among players at the table. It is unethical for one player to tell the other to fold (which by the way violates the one player per hand rule) or say I owe you one fold &#8230; what happens when these guys are in a hand with a third player between them? This history is going to look and smell like they are working together &#8211; not cool, and depending on the card room, not safe.</p>
<p>The second example &#8211; the player&#8217;s words boil down to call &#8211; regardless if he folds or not &#8211; he called &#8211; end of story by saying &#8220;i will pay you &#8230;&#8221; &#8230; the dealer was wrong by saying he did not have to pay.</p>
<p>No disrespect to charity rooms, but this type of stuff is exactly why I avoid them &#8211; especially for cash games &#8230; my recommendation for you would be Motor City or MGM (in that order) &#8230;</p>
<p>Too many players watch too much television &#8211; they do not have the skill or experience to try to get fancy with the verbal game &#8211; they need to stick to saying &#8220;call, raise, fold&#8221; &#8230;</p>
<p>Now, I play the occasional tournament at a charity room, and without exception, i see mistakes by dealers and floor every night &#8211; they too generally do not have the experience or training to know the little details and such &#8230;</p>
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		<title>Comment on Texas Holdem Rulings by Sammy Wynn</title>
		<link>http://geekbynight.com/?p=269#comment-22</link>
		<dc:creator>Sammy Wynn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jan 2012 20:18:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://geekbynight.com/?p=269#comment-22</guid>
		<description>ha ha ... what happened was the guy went all in - there is no betting line at MotorCity - I call and put the chips out, the dealer looks to see if any more action, pulls the chips in, spaces out for a second, looks up to see the cards in front of him, and he pulls them into the muck. Honest mistake.

To prevent it, the player needed to protect his cards - when the cards come out, my finger is on top of it immediately after it is in my &quot;space&quot; and my fingers stay on the cards until it is my turn to act, then I look and either cap &#039;em or dump &#039;em ... saw too much of this kind of sitcom stuff to not protect it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ha ha &#8230; what happened was the guy went all in &#8211; there is no betting line at MotorCity &#8211; I call and put the chips out, the dealer looks to see if any more action, pulls the chips in, spaces out for a second, looks up to see the cards in front of him, and he pulls them into the muck. Honest mistake.</p>
<p>To prevent it, the player needed to protect his cards &#8211; when the cards come out, my finger is on top of it immediately after it is in my &#8220;space&#8221; and my fingers stay on the cards until it is my turn to act, then I look and either cap &#8216;em or dump &#8216;em &#8230; saw too much of this kind of sitcom stuff to not protect it.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Texas Holdem Rulings by Eric</title>
		<link>http://geekbynight.com/?p=269#comment-21</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jan 2012 19:25:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://geekbynight.com/?p=269#comment-21</guid>
		<description>The Dealer mucked the cards and the dude is still betting?  This is hilarious! This has to be written into a sitcom right now!

If the Dealer has accidently mucked your cards a few times during the evening, can you ask for a new Dealer?  Does the Floor give the Dealer any warnings?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Dealer mucked the cards and the dude is still betting?  This is hilarious! This has to be written into a sitcom right now!</p>
<p>If the Dealer has accidently mucked your cards a few times during the evening, can you ask for a new Dealer?  Does the Floor give the Dealer any warnings?</p>
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		<title>Comment on Texas Holdem Rulings by Sammy Wynn</title>
		<link>http://geekbynight.com/?p=269#comment-20</link>
		<dc:creator>Sammy Wynn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jan 2012 15:20:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://geekbynight.com/?p=269#comment-20</guid>
		<description>Good point - here is an interesting story: At Midnight Rose in Cripple Creek, Colorado, there is a seasoned dealer named Craig. When he sits down, he has a standard speil that includes &quot;protect your cards - if they are not capped, I will muck them.&quot; And he does - without exception ... another story - some drunk at Motor City goes all in preflop - he is in seat 6 directly across from the dealer ... I call with a big pair from seat 9. All others fold and the dealer ships me the pot ... the cards were uprotected and the dealer spaced out and forgot the player went all in ... we call floor - floor says too bad - so I offer to chop it so this drunk gets his money back - floor says no, so I plead the case for the drunk - they say yes - and what does the grateful drunk do? picks up the chips and cashes out - it was only $50 or so, but still ... 

I was in a hand with a guy - he was also in seat 6 (me in 9) ... he bet the flop with cards - he bet the turn with not cards - i thought he pulled them off the table or something - so when he bets the river, i asked him where his cards were ... dealer mucked them on the flop by accident - WTF right?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good point &#8211; here is an interesting story: At Midnight Rose in Cripple Creek, Colorado, there is a seasoned dealer named Craig. When he sits down, he has a standard speil that includes &#8220;protect your cards &#8211; if they are not capped, I will muck them.&#8221; And he does &#8211; without exception &#8230; another story &#8211; some drunk at Motor City goes all in preflop &#8211; he is in seat 6 directly across from the dealer &#8230; I call with a big pair from seat 9. All others fold and the dealer ships me the pot &#8230; the cards were uprotected and the dealer spaced out and forgot the player went all in &#8230; we call floor &#8211; floor says too bad &#8211; so I offer to chop it so this drunk gets his money back &#8211; floor says no, so I plead the case for the drunk &#8211; they say yes &#8211; and what does the grateful drunk do? picks up the chips and cashes out &#8211; it was only $50 or so, but still &#8230; </p>
<p>I was in a hand with a guy &#8211; he was also in seat 6 (me in 9) &#8230; he bet the flop with cards &#8211; he bet the turn with not cards &#8211; i thought he pulled them off the table or something &#8211; so when he bets the river, i asked him where his cards were &#8230; dealer mucked them on the flop by accident &#8211; WTF right?</p>
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		<title>Comment on Texas Holdem Rulings by Eric</title>
		<link>http://geekbynight.com/?p=269#comment-19</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jan 2012 14:25:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://geekbynight.com/?p=269#comment-19</guid>
		<description>Wow...the dealer mucked your quad Queens?????  And you would have gotten the bad beat jackpot?????

There is no justice in the world!

I&#039;ve also had the Dealer accidently grab my cards on a few occasions.  Why don&#039;t we change the rules, so that when we fold, we push the cards in front of us, but the Dealer doesn&#039;t collect them until the hand is over?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow&#8230;the dealer mucked your quad Queens?????  And you would have gotten the bad beat jackpot?????</p>
<p>There is no justice in the world!</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve also had the Dealer accidently grab my cards on a few occasions.  Why don&#8217;t we change the rules, so that when we fold, we push the cards in front of us, but the Dealer doesn&#8217;t collect them until the hand is over?</p>
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		<title>Comment on Texas Holdem Rulings by Sammy Wynn</title>
		<link>http://geekbynight.com/?p=269#comment-18</link>
		<dc:creator>Sammy Wynn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jan 2012 21:27:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://geekbynight.com/?p=269#comment-18</guid>
		<description>Discretion is part of it. Bottom line on the rules is to prevent collusion and cheating. And yes, it has been my experience in card rooms across the country that if there is an opportunity to make a decision favorable to a player due to relationships, yet be within the rules, then decisions favor the relationships.

That said, and again - speaking from personal experience - I have had a few decisions that cost me money but I believe the decisions were made in good faith. I have also had decisions that financially favored me for several hundred dollars - and the decision could have gone the other way (like the telephone thing) - BUT there was no collusion or cheating - nobody EVER asked me for a &quot;cut&quot; of the windfall ...

The worst thing that ever happened to me was a dealer was talking to seat 10 the entire hand - i was in seat 9 - announced all-in as i looked the dealer in the eye - i shift my focus back to a third player in the hand after i uncapped my cards and put the chips in ... the dealer mucked my hand after i was all-in - he thought i folded was his story. Truth is I flopped quad Queens - third player in the hand turned quad 9s - and the dealer missed out on the tips from what would have been a $300,000 bad beat jackpot in Black Hawk Colorado ...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Discretion is part of it. Bottom line on the rules is to prevent collusion and cheating. And yes, it has been my experience in card rooms across the country that if there is an opportunity to make a decision favorable to a player due to relationships, yet be within the rules, then decisions favor the relationships.</p>
<p>That said, and again &#8211; speaking from personal experience &#8211; I have had a few decisions that cost me money but I believe the decisions were made in good faith. I have also had decisions that financially favored me for several hundred dollars &#8211; and the decision could have gone the other way (like the telephone thing) &#8211; BUT there was no collusion or cheating &#8211; nobody EVER asked me for a &#8220;cut&#8221; of the windfall &#8230;</p>
<p>The worst thing that ever happened to me was a dealer was talking to seat 10 the entire hand &#8211; i was in seat 9 &#8211; announced all-in as i looked the dealer in the eye &#8211; i shift my focus back to a third player in the hand after i uncapped my cards and put the chips in &#8230; the dealer mucked my hand after i was all-in &#8211; he thought i folded was his story. Truth is I flopped quad Queens &#8211; third player in the hand turned quad 9s &#8211; and the dealer missed out on the tips from what would have been a $300,000 bad beat jackpot in Black Hawk Colorado &#8230;</p>
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		<title>Comment on Texas Holdem Rulings by Eric</title>
		<link>http://geekbynight.com/?p=269#comment-17</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jan 2012 14:20:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://geekbynight.com/?p=269#comment-17</guid>
		<description>First, Player 2 had King, King.  (I updated the post.) 

Second, I find it interesting that the State gaming laws differentiate between a &quot;right&quot; and a &quot;duty&quot;.  Does this mean that if the Dealer has a friend at the table (this happens A LOT), he can make decisions that are favorable to this guy?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>First, Player 2 had King, King.  (I updated the post.) </p>
<p>Second, I find it interesting that the State gaming laws differentiate between a &#8220;right&#8221; and a &#8220;duty&#8221;.  Does this mean that if the Dealer has a friend at the table (this happens A LOT), he can make decisions that are favorable to this guy?</p>
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